Cameron, during your mammoth germination project, I can't remember if you germinated Jubaea chilensis.
I've ordered a small, pricey pack 😕 of the blue form.

http://www.palmsnorth.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4040

Thanks...busy time of year I know but looking forward to your update. 😉

Barb

I wonder how D. wheeleri will do outdoors for you Barb? They can take some cold when dry in winter and your dry. I tried a 5 gal outside here in Mass. and it died....probably from our excess winter moisture. Who's growing them in the cold/dry areas? How much cold can they take?? Who's killed them in dry conditions?

PS, you got a load of seedlings. They appear to be searching for sun. Mine had much shorter leaves (first row of plants at the bottom of photo).
<img src= >

After a 48 hour soak, looks like water's softening the seedcoat. :colors:

Will add more hydrogen peroxide to the water to get rid of fungus.
Soaking beside woodstove in basement, temp approx. 85 F

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6582595723/" title="DSC05192 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05192"></a>

Next, a few P.dactylifera:

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6582595713/" title="DSC05194 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05194"></a>

There's nothing like signs of new life for the New Year!
:headbang:

Barb

Nice work, Barb!

I had previously been pretty reluctant to talk about my Jubaea seeds, because they were actually my biggest failure 😆

As you've seen earlier in the post, I was able to successfully de-lid the seeds, and have around 90% of them germinate within a couple of days. Unfortunately, I didn't take enough measures to keep the de-lidded seeds in a sterile environment (that's the main problem when de-lidding seeds; although they will readily germinate, they generally aren't as strong as seeds that germinate naturally). Although I sterilized the soil with boiling water, air was still passing over the seeds, and this allowed mold to take over. The end result was that every Jubaea seedling died. I had de-lidded seeds of other species, and none of these had the same problems that the Jubaeas did. I guess Jubaeas must just be more sensitive to the environment compared to the rest. Luckily, I do still have some seeds to try germinating again 🙄

Barb, I would recommend that you crack the outer shell of the seeds (but be careful). Also, keep them in a well-draining mix, with high temps for the bottom heat.

Barb awesome job!!!

Cameron they were my biggest failure too! Still have 5 seeds in soil, still waiting.

Paul

I wonder how D. wheeleri will do outdoors for you Barb? They can take some cold when dry in winter and your dry. I tried a 5 gal outside here in Mass. and it died....probably from our excess winter moisture. Who's growing them in the cold/dry areas? How much cold can they take?? Who's killed them in dry conditions?

PS, you got a load of seedlings. They appear to be searching for sun. Mine had much shorter leaves (first row of plants at the bottom of photo).

Mine have long skinny leaves maybe not as long. Could be to much fertilizer?
I have tried a few in the past, but they were very small plants and died. I have seen bigger ones make it through the winter in Boise ID (6b) I got the seeds by my place in AZ. They had no damage after 0f so only time will tell. I have heard from a few people that if the crown stays very dry they do well? If you want some I still have some. Very easy to sprout. 😉

Tim,

you got a load of seedlings. They appear to be searching for sun

Yes, I started the Dasylirion wheeleri in a community pot in the darkish basement under that red/blue light thingy so they did stretch.
On sunny days I put the pot outside, even forgetting to bring it in when it was cold 😐

I do hope they'll make it in my dry winter/summer conditions.
If they like heat, which Aaron agrees they do, this is the right place as long as winter doesn't kill them once planted out.
Wonder when to separate them from their community pot and place them into individual pots (and for how long before planting out?)

Tim, your planting bed is fabulous!!!! 😀 Love the blue colors!
Looks like beach sand?

Cameron,
Ah, I recall reading about the boiling water (but thought that was so successful).
Sorry Cameron I thought they were alive!

air was still passing over the seeds, and this allowed mold to take over.

So with your next Jubaea seeds, will you bury them in the sterile soil to eliminate air?
Did you use hydrogen peroxide at all? If so, what ratio to water do you suggest?

recommend that you crack the outer shell of the seeds (but be careful).

Isn't it too late to crack them? now that they're so soft and hopefully breaking apart?

Thanks Cameron, will try to keep bottom heat at a good level of about 85 F (thank you woodstove!).
Will be interested in your next batch, hopefully with pics.

Aaron,

Mine have have long skinny leaves maybe not as long

Yours are probably in better light.
Mine are having trouble standing up, flopping over halfway, but still alive.

Barb

Barb, I think that the soil was sterile to begin with, but I both kept it too moist, and didn't have a cover on the container. This is what allowed the mold to start, and then take over so quickly. For the next ones, I will keep the soil less moist, and have a lid on the germinating container. I didn't use any hydrogen peroxide.

I don't think it's too late to crack the seeds; I did plant one seed (with the shell intact), and it has not even broken apart yet. They are very tough, and I think that it will take quite a bit of time for any water to soak through the outer shell and prompt germination. You might want to try cracking the shells on only one or two seeds, and at least have these two available to compare to the rest.

both kept it too moist, and didn't have a cover on the container.

Cameron, in my limited germination experience, I've had more mold on stuff that was covered than uncovered.
Perhaps drainage and airflow are the trick?

BTW, my 4 seeds of Jubaea pic (above)...I'm an idiot. 😆
All that "stuff" was just, well, stuff, almost like leftover pulp but I didn't notice anything on the seeds before that.
It scratched off with my fingernail and definitely was NOT a radicle starting 😆 😆

So I got out a framing hammer (drumroll) and started flailing away at the seed on the concrete floor.
Takes a bit of getting used to.
The first seed I ruined by hitting it too hard.
Pieces of it are all over the basement, couldn't find half of them.

The next few were easier, one really sharp rap (inside a cardboard box so I could find pieces again).
Then I lightly sandpapered where your pic indicated (on page 3 of this topic) and plopped them into expanded peat pots, then into clay pots.

You're right, that outer coat is really really strong, and I doubt water would have permeated that for a long long time.
Probably takes outdoor fungi/insect action in the ground to "work at the seedcoat".

Thanks!
Barb

Haven't a clue how to do these, so trying a bit of everything:

Expanded peat pellets on top of fast-draining soil in small clay pots:
<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6598206931/" title="DSC05198 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05198"></a>

Pushed the seeds in:
<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6598206961/" title="DSC05199 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05199"></a>

Covered with sand:
<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6598206967/" title="DSC05200 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05200"></a>

And placed individual baggies over the top.
On warm concrete floor beside basement woodstove.

The waiting begins. :sad11:

Barb

New seeds:

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6598292863/" title="DSC05210 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05210"></a>

Cleaning: strawy husk came off easily with a knife.
Then dropped into bowl of water 1 part hydrogen peroxide 3%, 5 parts water.
They all sank right away 😀

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6598292879/" title="DSC05212 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="640" height="480" alt="DSC05212"></a>

More waiting. :happy4:

Barb

Barb, I think that in order to keep the seeds as sterile as possible, I will try a combination of drainage and no airflow. Great work with the Jubaea seeds, as well as the others! It will be interesting to see how the (African?) oil palm seeds do.

Drumroll.....ta da! :clown:

Veitchia (Christmas palm) seed from John's trip to Mexico.

This one I sanded very very lightly (just to thin the hard outer coat, not to get into the white part at all).
Placed near woodstove in the hot basement +85F.

<a href=" http://www.flickr.com/photos/southslope/6674829523/" title="DSC05287 by edible_plum, on Flickr"><img src=" " width="480" height="640" alt="DSC05287"></a>

Germinated in one of those little expandable peat thingies, regular potting mix in the rest of pot, top dressed with sand in an effort to keep fungus gnat population down to a dull roar.

Barb

Barb congrats. What part of the seed did you sand? I`m sending out some of these tomorrow so it could help others and myself with quicker germination.

John

What part of the seed did you sand

I didn't know which part to sand, so I just did a gentle sanding (3 or 4 strokes) in the middle (like a Trachy or Waggie seed), not at either tip.
'coz I wasn't sure where the embryo was on these.

Here's my theory:
Sanding (lightly) ANYWHERE on the seed speeds nature's process of allowing water inside the hard coat.
That starts stuff happening inside, for lack of a more technical term.
I'm convinced the embryo will find a way out, nature will look after that.

In nature, when a seed drops from a tree and warm wet soil "works" on the hard seed coat, seeds pop despite some landing in awkward arrangements (sideways, on their points, or laying on top of other seeds?)

Nobody's around to "orient" and soften the seed coat in the "correct" area.

Definitely an amateurish answer, but that's all I can offer other than to say I always lay the seed horizontally on the soil about halfway into the soil (2 points just barely showing). 😉

BTW, I'd be worried about seed exposure to our current cold temps in the mailboxes...I think tropical seeds should NEVER freeze.