Trachy Experiment Update

(@wxman)

Posts: 574

Prominent Member

Topic starter

In November, I covered four trachycarpus fortunei with just a double poly box and strung 100 miniature Christmas lights around each. The lights were connected to a thermocube 35F on/45F off. Total power was around 40 watts per strand, so you can see each did not receive a lot of supplemental heat. I relied on the sun's solar energy to provide the majority of the heating. Well, the cold weather came and it got downright COLD in the boxes. Temperatures ranged from 8F to 18F within the boxes on the coldest nights of winter when ambient air temperature was around -10F. During the heart of winter, the ground froze to within a few inches of the trunk in each box.

Now, that the snow has receded from two of the boxes, I removed the boxes and lights for the summer. The other two will require a few more days of melting before I can remove them. Here are the results from the first two boxes.

Closeup of spear.

No spear pull on these two. Fronds look in mint to near-perfect condition yet. Soil is soft and moist around the palms; no longer frozen. I did not provide any supplemental water all winter.

As I stated above, the other two have a few days to go yet. 55F tomorrow and 60s on Thursday should let me get at them! (grin)

I think they main key to survival on trachycarpus fortunei is:

1) Getting above freezing each day. The solar energy propelled the temperature in the boxes to between 45F and 55F even on days it was 0F to 5F outside.

2) Keeping the wind off the palms. Even though it fell into the single digits, the air was dead calm within the boxes.

3) Ensuring excess moisture does not sit around the palm. Snow melt was their only source of moisture all winter.

4) Sunlight. Palms do not go dormant, thus require sunlight in the winter. I've seen so many people lose their palms due to wrapping them up tightly in leaf enclosures or enclosures where light cannot penetrate.

Posted : 15/03/2011 8:28 pm

Cameron_z6a_N.S.

(@cameron_z6a_n-s)

Posts: 1270

Noble Member

Good job!

Posted : 15/03/2011 8:34 pm

hardyjim

(@hardyjim)

Posts: 4697

Illustrious Member

You can actually lock down a Trachy -Sabal -Needle all winter in a cold box
with no light at all and pull them out in spring and there fine.

Another thing I would add-- is, moisture control-one thing that's nice(there are many 😆 )
about the Thermocubes is they consistently keep the temp above freezing
if you've provided enough heat/insulation.

My Washys were quite wet inside during the winter(I did burp the enclosures several times though)
the thing that saved them is no temps below freezing all winter...never.

Anyway enough about me 8)

Your palms look awesome,good job!

Oh....BTW

I can't believe how much snow you still have!
Getting rid of that will be a nice (green)welcome mat for spring!!!!!!

Posted : 15/03/2011 9:01 pm

CTPalm

(@ctpalm)

Posts: 161

Estimable Member

Wow, very impressive. You said solar energy to heat during the day, it looks like styrofoam panels on the sides under the plastic. Is one of the sides clear for sunlight to enter?

Paul

Posted : 15/03/2011 9:08 pm

wxman

(@wxman)

Posts: 574

Prominent Member

Topic starter

It's slightly opaque plastic. No foam is inside.

Posted : 15/03/2011 9:45 pm

Wes North Van

(@wes-north-van)

Posts: 907

Prominent Member

Your trachies look great.
They sure have full heads of fronds. They will look even better this fall.
Wow I can't believe how much snow you have though.

Wes North Vancouver Zone 8b/9a
Keats Island BC Zone 8a
Palm Springs CA Zone 9b/10a

Posted : 15/03/2011 10:02 pm

CTPalm

(@ctpalm)

Posts: 161

Estimable Member

Oh ok - is there a layer of plastic on the inside of box as well, or just around the outside. I know I have a lot of questions, I might be duplicating your method next winter.

Thanks
Paul

Posted : 15/03/2011 10:13 pm

wxman

(@wxman)

Posts: 574

Prominent Member

Topic starter

Paul,

I have a layer of plastic on the inside and outside. The air gap between them helps trap heat. Kind of like a double pane window.

Posted : 15/03/2011 10:32 pm

CTPalm

(@ctpalm)

Posts: 161

Estimable Member

wxman,

Thanks for all the info - I will def be using your method if I get the courage to put some of my trachies in the ground this year.

Thanks
Paul

Posted : 15/03/2011 11:15 pm

lucky1

(@lucky1)

Posts: 11322

Illustrious Member

Tim, fabulous!
Look at that spear...and another one coming.
Not a mark from winter! Well done.

Agree with your #1 and #2.

#3 is virtually impossible here, as we are generally frozen solid ground before it snows.
So to have, as you say, thawed ground under all that snow, blows me away.
We'd have to get rid of the foot of snow and then thawing of the ground could occur from sunshine and warmer temps.

#4 doubtful.
Damir (I think it's him) encloses his Trachy solidly in 2-inch styro (no window) every winter all winter.
Comes out fresh as a daisy, gorgeous colour, doesn't skip a beat.

My palm hut has a clear roof but the sun's so low in winter that no sunshine lands on any Trachy fronds.
By the time the sun's higher, the palm hut is dismantled again.

So the solar gain in enclosure temperature is the benefit, not sunlight shining on the palm.

Barb

If you drink, don't drive. Don't even putt.

Posted : 16/03/2011 1:14 am

TerdalFarm

(@terdalfarm)

Posts: 2981

Famed Member

Tim,
great thread, and as a a serial Trachy killer I really appreciate the discussion.
Let's please keep it up! --Erik

Posted : 16/03/2011 10:15 am

oppalm

(@oppalm)

Posts: 694

Honorable Member

wxman nicely done. great information. Although, I have had perfectly good luck with smaller trachys completely covering them with leaf mulch cages and tarps - no sunshine from November thru March -= and they look perfectly good when uncovered in March. Interesting discussion.

Kent in Kansas
where it's cold in winter (always)
and hot in summer (usually)
<object width="290" height="130"><param name="movie" value="http://www.wunderground.com/swf/pws_mini_rf_nc.swf?station=KKSOVERL7&freq=2.5&units=english&lang=EN" /><embed src="http://www.wunderground.com/swf/pws_mini_rf_nc.swf?station=KKSOVERL7&freq=2.5&units=english&lang=EN" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="290" height="130" /></object>

Posted : 16/03/2011 10:30 am

wxman

(@wxman)

Posts: 574

Prominent Member

Topic starter

wxman nicely done. great information. Although, I have had perfectly good luck with smaller trachys completely covering them with leaf mulch cages and tarps - no sunshine from November thru March -= and they look perfectly good when uncovered in March. Interesting discussion.

Interesting. I tried a few this winter with that tactic and they are rotted and dead. I think the difference between my location and yours is that you regularly get above freezing on winter days ... I don't. So a leaf cage actually keeps them below freezing for months on end which is a no no.

They would have a better chance up here in an empty poly enclosure where they could thaw out with the warmth of the sunlight each day. Might try that next winter on a few new specimens. Poly enclosure with zero heat.

Posted : 16/03/2011 1:39 pm

wxman

(@wxman)

Posts: 574

Prominent Member

Topic starter

wxman nicely done. great information. Although, I have had perfectly good luck with smaller trachys completely covering them with leaf mulch cages and tarps - no sunshine from November thru March -= and they look perfectly good when uncovered in March. Interesting discussion.

Interesting. I tried a few this winter with that tactic and they are rotted and dead. I think the difference between my location and yours is that you regularly get above freezing on winter days ... I don't. So a leaf cage actually keeps them below freezing for months on end which is a no no.

They would have a better chance up here in an empty poly enclosure where they could thaw out with the warmth of the sunlight each day. Might try that next winter on a few new specimens. Poly enclosure with zero heat.

Posted : 16/03/2011 1:42 pm

TerdalFarm

(@terdalfarm)

Posts: 2981

Famed Member

Interesting discussion indeed!
I have given up on the leaf cage method down here as I always got rot that way. 😕

Posted : 16/03/2011 1:47 pm