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Damage to Trachys,etc, from prolonged cold

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lucky1
(@lucky1)
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leaves are a healthy green, but have folded a little, either due to drought or prolonged exposure to cold. Is the soil frozen at all?

The "healthy green" T. nainital leaves faded to lighter green, drier (shredded) appearance, after removing the plastic garbage can as temps neared 0C.

Soil was frozen, ~no/little snow this year.
No heat provided.
No wind exposure.
Min. -20.6C -5F on Dec.14
approx -8C when applying FreezePruf.

Leaf area after FreezePruf:

Barb

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/cgi-bin/banner/ban/wxBanner?bannertype=wu_bluestripes_both&airportcode=CWJV&ForcedCity=Vernon&ForcedState=Canada&wmo=71115&language=EN" alt="Find more about Weather in Vernon, CA" width="160" />

If you drink, don't drive. Don't even putt.

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 12:53 pm
(@hardyjim)
Posts: 4697
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Barb your leaf right next to the spear is right on the edge and is probably damaged beyond return.
Keep a close watch on that leaf(the one next to the spear)it is a good indicator of the health of the growth point.
If it starts to dry up you may want to give it a little tug,however even if it pulls the rest of the palm is in great
shape so no worries,at most you would lose it and the spear but lets not rush to judgment on that yet.
Besides the one leaf the palm is in great shape.

Another example-remember this picture?
Count out from the middle,the newest spear,the one starting to open at 9 0'clock and the bigger one at 11 0'clock
all pulled yesterday.The leaf at 11:00 is an indictor of the spears health,you can see it's burned/closed beyond the border where
the blades reconnect,these never reopened and went downhill.This was a clear indication the spear was cut off from nutrients.
All that is left is a giant cavity,if you lose leaves from this point you know the infection/rot is moving south.
At this point you keep a close eye on the health of the next leaves down the line and wait,wait wait until spring if your a lucky1.

This damage most likely happened right after December 1 when our weather went from mild (Oct/Nov-Dec 1st 61f)to
below freezing with no acclimatization at all for these plants.Early Arctic cold in January finished the job.
The sad thing is these palms can handle the cold now since they have had time to adjust-)-:

<a href=" " target="_blank"><img src=" " border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> 😥 😥

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/big2_cond/language/www/US/IA/Fairfield.gif" alt="Click for Fairfield, Iowa Forecast" border="0" height="60" width="468" />

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 3:37 pm
(@bill-ma)
Posts: 1272
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That really stinks Jim. I thought things were looking more on the positive side.

Bill

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/htmlSticker2_cond/language/www/US/MA/Attleboro.gif">

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 4:20 pm
(@hardyjim)
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Another uncle killing heartbreaker for sure!
The rest of the palm is green so we'll see what happens in spring,
which Fortunei-ately is just around the corner!

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/big2_cond/language/www/US/IA/Fairfield.gif" alt="Click for Fairfield, Iowa Forecast" border="0" height="60" width="468" />

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 4:25 pm
(@terdalfarm)
Posts: 2981
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Darn.
I'll add photos of my Trachy when I have the heart to do it. --Erik

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 6:56 pm
lucky1
(@lucky1)
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Yes, I remember that picture.
Oh no, those two pulled? 😥

But they did look so good (for a while).

One thing I read about somewhere is that palm fronds that exhibit that "accordion folding" almost-stunted waviness of the younger spear had something to do with nutrient deficiency. I don't recall if it was related to the common phrase "frizzle top" when referring to Florida's LY-palms.
I'll find it again and send it.

Thanks for explaining that Jim.

I was under the impression the hastula had to be a lemon yellow "halo" to stop nutrient movement (re the 11 o'clock spear).
It didn't look bad at all to me!

Fortunei-ately is just around the corner!

well said.

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/cgi-bin/banner/ban/wxBanner?bannertype=wu_bluestripes_both&airportcode=CWJV&ForcedCity=Vernon&ForcedState=Canada&wmo=71115&language=EN" alt="Find more about Weather in Vernon, CA" width="160" />

If you drink, don't drive. Don't even putt.

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 8:43 pm
(@hardyjim)
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I know how you feel Erik

Barb
The lighter color is indicative of a leaf cut off from it's nutrient supply in this case.

The yellow ring is from those pictures that John commented on,yes improper carb/sugar distribution in the old leaf.

Hopefully this takes you there-

http://www.palmsociety.org.uk/forum/topic.asp?boardid=1&show=31&page=6&topicid=2435

Thanks Barb

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Posted : 05/02/2010 8:53 pm
(@terdalfarm)
Posts: 2981
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Jim,
the link took me there once I signed in.
We have never-ending light and cold rain so I'm keeping the poor Trachy as protected as possible. I have a funnel (with stopper) over the spear, an arm-load of loose hay, then a 20 gallon bucket upside down and supported by stakes to protect the crown from cold and rain. The hay has stayed dry, thank goodness; the cold rain just won't stop. When it does I'll replace the hay with fresh hay. As for now, I am confident the tree will survive but without most/all leaves. No basis for that optimism 🙁
--Erik

 
Posted : 05/02/2010 9:14 pm
lucky1
(@lucky1)
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Yes got it thanks, Jim.
That's the picture I remember.

Erik, good stop-gap measure.
And good timing.
If the hay's dry, no need to replace it.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if--in May--we're all laughing because they ALL survived.
Here we are fussing like old hens and...roosters 😉

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If you drink, don't drive. Don't even putt.

 
Posted : 06/02/2010 12:20 am
(@hardyjim)
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Erik
We had that weather right after the brutal cold of early January,
something like 2 weeks of cold ,cloudy(no sun!),foggy weather-ending with an ice storm.

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/big2_cond/language/www/US/IA/Fairfield.gif" alt="Click for Fairfield, Iowa Forecast" border="0" height="60" width="468" />

 
Posted : 06/02/2010 3:06 pm
(@terdalfarm)
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Barb, thanks for the encouragement. February always seems like the longest month. My hens and roosters are totally dependent on bagged feed but they roam all over the garden hoping for some "real" food. To them, that means bugs. No luck.
Jim, fun to "see" you in "Europe" overnight (Paul, too).
No rain today so I took buckets off to let moisture out. The hay on the Trachy crown + all over small Butia and Ch. humilis is dry and so will be out in the cool north winds for the afternoon to stay dry.
Tomorrow we're back to cold rain relieved only by "warm" snow. No end in sight.
🙁
I'm keeping the south flap on the large Butia hut (AKA heated dog house) open today. Fronds look good to me, except where they were in contact with the plastic walls where they look as good as you imagine (i.e., dry and brown).
--Erik

 
Posted : 06/02/2010 3:16 pm
(@hardyjim)
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Yep-you to Erik
Forecasting 6-10" of snow here- winter not going away anytime soon!

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/big2_cond/language/www/US/IA/Fairfield.gif" alt="Click for Fairfield, Iowa Forecast" border="0" height="60" width="468" />

 
Posted : 07/02/2010 10:49 pm
(@terdalfarm)
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We have a forecast of 4" - 5" of snow for tomorrow. Lows only in the mid-teens, though, the next couple of nights.
There is still a bit of green on the exposed Trachy leaves. Not too bad given what they've been through the past six weeks.
I haven't uncovered the crown to tug the spear lately so I'm just hoping it'll make it to Spring.
I had fun reading the EPS forum today to get a different perspective. --Erik

 
Posted : 08/02/2010 12:27 am
lucky1
(@lucky1)
Posts: 11322
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a different perspective

Why? Because their palms are alive? 😆
Barb

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If you drink, don't drive. Don't even putt.

 
Posted : 08/02/2010 10:38 am
(@hardyjim)
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They have been hit hard there,lost lots'o palms!

<img src="http://weathersticker.wunderground.com/weathersticker/big2_cond/language/www/US/IA/Fairfield.gif" alt="Click for Fairfield, Iowa Forecast" border="0" height="60" width="468" />

 
Posted : 08/02/2010 3:07 pm
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